Depression

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Has anyone ever taken to writing a daily journal, but writing it as if it's two different versions of yourself writing notes to each other? I've been doing that this past month and it has been a decent outlet for emotions I wouldn't otherwise express to people. It makes the weekends tough, though, when it's just the physical me by itself.
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rodox_head wrote:Has anyone ever taken to writing a daily journal, but writing it as if it's two different versions of yourself writing notes to each other? I've been doing that this past month and it has been a decent outlet for emotions I wouldn't otherwise express to people. It makes the weekends tough, though, when it's just the physical me by itself.


I agree with writing thoughts or worries down that you keep in your head and not out loud, I sometimes do that to understand a certain situation. I think that if i put it down on paper, it’ll give me better control of whatever I’m thinking about going forward, sort of a place for emotions to rest outside of the body (even for a short while, if that makes sense)

Although I’m not a generally a unhappy person sometimes I have bouts of depression if I’m stuck in a day to day cycle of little to no variety or change. same faces, same words. When the clocks changed I become unmotivated, unclear with daily direction. It’s a bit on and off though.

Hope your keeping well, It’s good that threads like these exist, unnoticed to few but impactful to others.

Just call me the friendly forum agony aunt! :wink:
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Orbited insanitarium wrote:
rodox_head wrote:Has anyone ever taken to writing a daily journal, but writing it as if it's two different versions of yourself writing notes to each other? I've been doing that this past month and it has been a decent outlet for emotions I wouldn't otherwise express to people. It makes the weekends tough, though, when it's just the physical me by itself.


I agree with writing thoughts or worries down that you keep in your head and not out loud, I sometimes do that to understand a certain situation. I think that if i put it down on paper, it’ll give me better control of whatever I’m thinking about going forward, sort of a place for emotions to rest outside of the body (even for a short while, if that makes sense)

Although I’m not a generally a unhappy person sometimes I have bouts of depression if I’m stuck in a day to day cycle of little to no variety or change. same faces, same words. When the clocks changed I become unmotivated, unclear with daily direction. It’s a bit on and off though.

Hope your keeping well, It’s good that threads like these exist, unnoticed to few but impactful to others.

Just call me the friendly forum agony aunt! :wink:

I've always been suggested writing a journal for that reason, and while it makes sense to me, it never quite worked for me and I would find myself just falling into a pattern of self-loathing eventually. Treating it like a "back and forth" kinda forces me into an appropriate mentality for reflection. I guess I try to channel the same sort of energy from my current avatar.

The daily grind sure gets to me, although it's difficult for me to relate to some others' since mine is in literal darkness :roll: . Seriously, did the whole world decide on one time zone without telling me? It feels like once it gets deep into night time nothing happens on the internet. I stepped out of my usual weekend routine this weekend and went to the mall; despite half the shops being empty there was a substantial amount of people out and about, all wearing masks too which is an oddity in my town. Funny how just stepping slightly outside the city limits makes a difference. Friends and families hanging out with each other, then there's me walking around looking not too dissimilar to Allison from The Breakfast Club listening to weird electronica :P

Maybe I'm not the best source of help as I essentially had to make up imaginary friends to get by :lol:
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I have fought depression all My life, since I entered double digits. At least one major depression per decade, sometimes two.
I saw therapists, psychologists, psychiatrists, I tried several methods, I tried medication, I tried meditation, gym, whatever, I was about to go for electroshock therapy.

In the end, I realized that it was not related to what was going on in My thoughts, but rather what was going on with My brain, physically.

Once they put Me on Cymbalta (duloxetine) it was like a breach through the clouds, it was not a miracle, but it allowed Me to actually get moving... I got to do a bit more exercise, I got to take fun again in My hobbies, a little, in My work, a little, and those things are cumulative, so the further I got, the better it was.

My Dr told Me that because I reacted so fast (within 2 weeks) and so strongly (at first) it was probably a sign that I was having some disbalance that was genetic in My case since it seemed to be totally not epigenetic and kept coming back no matter what.

SNRIs work by blocking the reabsorption (or reuptake) of serotonin and norepinephrine (especially the latter in My case) back into the nerve cells that released them, which increases the levels of active neurotransmitters in the brain.

In short, that is what allowed Me to move from completely stalled (depression is not necessarily sadness, it is in My case being completely stalled, helpless, without even the will to get out of bed) to actually start to move a bit, and that is something that goes a LONG way even if the steps at first are tiny.

It's a crutch, one that in My case I will have to take all My life, as soon as I get below a certain threshold, I fall back, I have GAD (General Anxiety Disorder) and once I hit that low everything goes down. Mind you, I never, ever, had a suicidal thought, so for Me, depression is singularly really a question of movement and will.

Anyways, all of this to tell you all... medicine as we have it today is crude, it's full of side effects, it's not super effective, but I do hope that all who follow us will have access to better medicine than this. Don't give up, if this is what it takes to get you going, ask your doctor... it's complicated, it's not a silver bullet, but sometimes it's that little one degree slope that gets the ball rolling.

Don't give up, ever, you will come out of it a victory. I know I did, time and time again.

I know, long ramble, I just wanted to give a little of a bright light to all of you that sit in the dark tonight or tomorrow or ten years from now and stumble upon this... I made it through, you can too.
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It gets better.
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Jonse wrote:It gets better.
Neutrally speaking, that seems more like a gamblers fallacy.
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You should definitely check this man, he' talking about dopamine and how it affects your motivation. Genuinely helpful stuff. Also cold showers is a real deal. Both improve your mental and physical state. I am on my second month cold showers only and it is amazing. Tho, I always was trying my self with cold. Just its only cold showers now. Also I have depression here and there. Mostly because I was doing my bjj training for the past 10-15 years. And lately there was injuries after injuries. Young 19 teen guys almost rag dolling you. And you realise, that you are getting old. But it is good to compensate one thing for another. Breathing exercises, healthy food, no alcohol and so on.
\o

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arvy wrote:
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You should definitely check this man, he' talking about dopamine and how it affects your motivation. Genuinely helpful stuff. Also cold showers is a real deal. Both improve your mental and physical state. I am on my second month cold showers only and it is amazing. Tho, I always was trying my self with cold. Just its only cold showers now. Also I have depression here and there. Mostly because I was doing my bjj training for the past 10-15 years. And lately there was injuries after injuries. Young 19 teen guys almost rag dolling you. And you realise, that you are getting old. But it is good to compensate one thing for another. Breathing exercises, healthy food, no alcohol and so on.

I watched about half of that so far; some really interesting stuff in there actually. Found it interesting that caffeine doesn't directly increase dopamine. Keeping oneself in a certain rhythm certainly helps keep a mood more stable, it might be why I gravitate towards genres like Trance, Techno, and DnB so much, it keeps the inside of my head looking like Webdriver Torso.

I think the chemical aspect is still not the complete picture in a lot of cases, sometimes just the mere attitude of looking out your window to not see much to be optimistic about can leave a heavy burden for your serotonin levels. More often than not, in an instance where I'm feeling cheerful and step outside I'm easily confronted by the drab faces of others and a feeling of empathy and guilt washes over immediately. At work I once took great pride in doing a great job, and still find it difficult to show a subpar work ethic to some degree, but compounded with the notion that my company does not value it in the slightest and being not so sure if my colleagues are even worth fighting for (if that's even possible), further drives those levels down. And isolation, let's not forget about that. Certain personal revelations also pile on. Living with MDD can just feel like having the "They Live" glasses on 24/7, in a non-edgy way, I don't consider myself more "intelligent" for seeing the negative side to things at all.

But this is also all just personal anecdotes, I totally get how this can work for a lot of people. I don't want to make it seem like I don't agree with what you're putting out there.

As for cold showers, I'll stick to hot for now since my apartment's pretty chilly in the wintertime. I heard it's good for the skin though.
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rodox_head wrote:
arvy wrote:
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You should definitely check this man, he' talking about dopamine and how it affects your motivation. Genuinely helpful stuff. Also cold showers is a real deal. Both improve your mental and physical state. I am on my second month cold showers only and it is amazing. Tho, I always was trying my self with cold. Just its only cold showers now. Also I have depression here and there. Mostly because I was doing my bjj training for the past 10-15 years. And lately there was injuries after injuries. Young 19 teen guys almost rag dolling you. And you realise, that you are getting old. But it is good to compensate one thing for another. Breathing exercises, healthy food, no alcohol and so on.

I watched about half of that so far; some really interesting stuff in there actually. Found it interesting that caffeine doesn't directly increase dopamine. Keeping oneself in a certain rhythm certainly helps keep a mood more stable, it might be why I gravitate towards genres like Trance, Techno, and DnB so much, it keeps the inside of my head looking like Webdriver Torso.

I think the chemical aspect is still not the complete picture in a lot of cases, sometimes just the mere attitude of looking out your window to not see much to be optimistic about can leave a heavy burden for your serotonin levels. More often than not, in an instance where I'm feeling cheerful and step outside I'm easily confronted by the drab faces of others and a feeling of empathy and guilt washes over immediately. At work I once took great pride in doing a great job, and still find it difficult to show a subpar work ethic to some degree, but compounded with the notion that my company does not value it in the slightest and being not so sure if my colleagues are even worth fighting for (if that's even possible), further drives those levels down. And isolation, let's not forget about that. Certain personal revelations also pile on. Living with MDD can just feel like having the "They Live" glasses on 24/7, in a non-edgy way, I don't consider myself more "intelligent" for seeing the negative side to things at all.

But this is also all just personal anecdotes, I totally get how this can work for a lot of people. I don't want to make it seem like I don't agree with what you're putting out there.

As for cold showers, I'll stick to hot for now since my apartment's pretty chilly in the wintertime. I heard it's good for the skin though.


Personally for me the main recipe for happiness in life is simple - no alcohol. Tho, it is much harder to achieve, than it seams. There are many variables. Is it possible to have some from time to time when going out? Or is it simpler just don't go out whatsoever? I can say one thing for sure, that life is a little less exciting without the cold one, but it is still exciting nonetheless. I also cam to one interesting observation, what cause what. Is it depression cause you to drink, o drinking cause the depression. Perfect example which came first, the chicken or the egg.
\o

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arvy wrote:Personally for me the main recipe for happiness in life is simple - no alcohol. Tho, it is much harder to achieve, than it seams. There are many variables. Is it possible to have some from time to time when going out? Or is it simpler just don't go out whatsoever? I can say one thing for sure, that life is a little less exciting without the cold one, but it is still exciting nonetheless. I also cam to one interesting observation, what cause what. Is it depression cause you to drink, o drinking cause the depression. Perfect example which came first, the chicken or the egg.

I rarely drink either, only during special occasions or when going to a nice restaurant with others, even then I'm good at gauging when I should stop. While I'm sure it's a case-by-case basis, from my experience, it was the depression that urged me to drink. When I first came of drinking age I could barely stomach beer, but one night at a party about a couple years later I just started going to town on the wine because of that. Just a few years ago I would go through at least a pint of whiskey every weekend, and sometimes I feel an inkling of an urge to go back because I remember how, even though it was feelings of sadness, it caused me to feel at least something. Crying is the orgasm to sadness I think I've once read before.
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rodox_head wrote:
arvy wrote:Personally for me the main recipe for happiness in life is simple - no alcohol. Tho, it is much harder to achieve, than it seams. There are many variables. Is it possible to have some from time to time when going out? Or is it simpler just don't go out whatsoever? I can say one thing for sure, that life is a little less exciting without the cold one, but it is still exciting nonetheless. I also cam to one interesting observation, what cause what. Is it depression cause you to drink, o drinking cause the depression. Perfect example which came first, the chicken or the egg.

I rarely drink either, only during special occasions or when going to a nice restaurant with others, even then I'm good at gauging when I should stop. While I'm sure it's a case-by-case basis, from my experience, it was the depression that urged me to drink. When I first came of drinking age I could barely stomach beer, but one night at a party about a couple years later I just started going to town on the wine because of that. Just a few years ago I would go through at least a pint of whiskey every weekend, and sometimes I feel an inkling of an urge to go back because I remember how, even though it was feelings of sadness, it caused me to feel at least something. Crying is the orgasm to sadness I think I've once read before.


Reasonable words. You have to make intelligent decisions in life, to be able to enjoy alcohol in moderation. Cause be able socialising in different environment, with different people and still keeping that healthy balance for you mental and physical state, can have all kind of benefits.
I'm not that person. Probably lacking intelligence in crucial moments while drinking, which can let slip things in hardly predictable direction. Which is actually not the worse thing. The worse thing is you can quietly drink your self up. This can lasts for years, then you notice it. It is extremely dangerous.
Funny enough, refusal of the alcohol gives me some sort of accomplishment. Tho, even if I don't do anything special, still I feel like going towards something.
It is also adds, that I was and became even less sociable. I can defend my personal space, if someone tries to snick in. And of course, people give up after some time. But like I said, I feel that I'm going somewhere. I'm on a mission. You have to understand.
\o

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A different take on depression.
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@Gazebo4
It may not be the cure for depression, but coming to an understanding of who or what you really are is major hurdle that's worth climbing over. I remember while I was at a major low point some years ago I began to stare deeply into the abyss inside myself and eventually came to see what was really there. I'm still not prepared to admit what I found to others, and sure as all hell not gonna say how I came to find that out. It may eventually lead me to my grave, but at least I'll have some sense of whatever the f*** I was when/if I decide to go.
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rodox_head wrote:@Gazebo4
It may not be the cure for depression, but coming to an understanding of who or what you really are is major hurdle that's worth climbing over. I remember while I was at a major low point some years ago I began to stare deeply into the abyss inside myself and eventually came to see what was really there. I'm still not prepared to admit what I found to others, and sure as all hell not gonna say how I came to find that out. It may eventually lead me to my grave, but at least I'll have some sense of whatever the f*** I was when/if I decide to go.


I have to somewhat disagree with you on that knowing who you are is not the cure for depression. When you start to see who you really are, it is seen that depression is a mental state. The mental state does not define you, because what you are is that which knows (or is aware of) the mental state. In other words, you can shift your attention from believing in the story of a person who suffers a depression to the awareness that pervades the experience of a person that is suffering from a depression. It's a total shift in consciousness, or rather an awakening of being aware, instead of continuously being identified with being a person and thus being asleep. So depression may be a part of you that exists temporarily, but as with all experiences they all come and go eventually.

From my own experience if there is one thing I would say to people in a depression it's this: stop fighting with yourself, get out of your own way and trust in the process that is unfolding right now. It is not a mistake, life makes no mistakes. In hindsight my 4 year depression was the best wake up call I could ever dream of, it was a divine gift I hated to experience when I went through it, but on the surface of the depression I found what I was actually looking for my whole live, myself. It's a peace that has no opposite. That which you are that exists before all experience. All thoughts, emotions and sense perceptions are born in you and they die in you, and all that is left is you. Look at your depression, your fears, your emotions, your thoughts, etc. and welcome them all in the unlimited, timeless capacity of that which you are and thank them for showing you the way back to your true home, you.

That is not to say it won't require courage, willingness and curiosity to face your ego. Because I know it's so easy to write this when I'm "on the other side". When you are in the middle of it shit is rough as fuck, so be gentle with yourself and know that all is well, even though it does oftentimes not feel like it at all. Know that all you experience is already happening and moving through you, so in a sense you are already accepting it. Else you wouldn't be here experiencing it right now. That is how strong you really are. Even the most intense suffering is already happening and thus already been accepted by life itself. Practice surrender to your true self and you will heal in time. It's the only way true healing can occur.
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Gazebo4 wrote:I have to somewhat disagree with you on that knowing who you are is not the cure for depression. When you start to see who you really are, it is seen that depression is a mental state. The mental state does not define you, because what you are is that which knows (or is aware of) the mental state. In other words, you can shift your attention from believing in the story of a person who suffers a depression to the awareness that pervades the experience of a person that is suffering from a depression. It's a total shift in consciousness, or rather an awakening of being aware, instead of continuously being identified with being a person and thus being asleep. So depression may be a part of you that exists temporarily, but as with all experiences they all come and go eventually.

From my own experience if there is one thing I would say to people in a depression it's this: stop fighting with yourself, get out of your own way and trust in the process that is unfolding right now. It is not a mistake, life makes no mistakes.

When I say "cure for depression", I'm referring to the medical sense of the word. Like Magrathea described in his post earlier, it's something that isn't going away, at least not anytime soon.

I think of two major questions when regarding accepting who you are:
1. How well would this person you see in yourself actually be accepted by others, or any greater surroundings?
2a. How much does depression truly define you when it can sometimes be the only thing people see about you due to one's reserved and near-schizoid personality?
2b. How much do you actually even exist without the outside perception of yourself?
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rodox_head wrote:When I say "cure for depression", I'm referring to the medical sense of the word. Like Magrathea described in his post earlier, it's something that isn't going away, at least not anytime soon.

I think of two major questions when regarding accepting who you are:
1. How well would this person you see in yourself actually be accepted by others, or any greater surroundings?
2a. How much does depression truly define you when it can sometimes be the only thing people see about you due to one's reserved and near-schizoid personality?
2b. How much do you actually even exist without the outside perception of yourself?


First of all, you are raising some very good and interesting questions! I will answer them from my own experience. And yes I misunderstood your comment specifically concerning the word "cure". From my own experience, it is not a direct cure if we talk about the medical condition itself disappearing (directly). It will be around yes, and it will leave you when it has done its work on you. I don't think you have much to say in that regard. However when your relationship with depression changes, it starts to go from this personal suffering that you endure, to this impersonal experience of depression. And specifically that is what is so beautiful about this, because to be free from the depression, doesn't mean you need to get rid of depression, you just need to find peace with it by seeing that it is ultimately a story about yourself. So even though the depression is still experienced and uncomfortable as hell, it makes you suffer less and less when you slowly start seeing that its root is not personal. That is the lesson that is learnt if one can truly start listening to depression without preconceived labels and prejudices.

1. The basis of this question is rooted in having a self-image. It is exactly this self-image that is the reason for needing acceptance outside of oneself in the first place. When you start seeing that the image of oneself is not your real or true self, it is not a self-image anymore. It is just an image, just like the image on a tv screen is not personal to the screen. It is experienced by the screen, but it is not the screen itself. It stops being personal and therefore stops being a problem/obstacle. A self-image is how we see ourselves and how we assume others see us, which is false, because it is just a story of 'me' and has nothing to do with direct experience of that which is known, namely thoughts, feelings and perceptions. They are experienced by you, but they are not you or they do not define you. In other words, your identification is not depended on your experience.

When two trees are standing next to each other, and one tree is this magnificent tree with lots of branches and beautiful, colorful leaves, standing in a perfect spot in the sunlight, while the other tree is a very small tree without many colorful leaves , standing in the shade of the bigger tree, does the smaller tree label itself as inferior? Or the bigger tree label itself as superior compared to the smaller tree? Do trees have a self-image so they can compare themselves to the image of another tree? No they don't, they just are. Yet the human mind labels itself as this or that, and then proceeds to compare itself to other images with other labels on the spectrum of good vs bad, which is dualistic illusion and creates inner and outer conflict. This is the problem and creates all the suffering in individuals and in the world at large.

2a. Very good question! I feel I need to be very honest here, when I was in the state you described so perfectly here it totally defined 'me' as a person. It was a long and dreadful phase so to speak. I will not argue that. But looking back on that particular dark hole, I now see that even though I was experiencing all of it, I was already aware and awake on the surface of the experience and I now see in hindsight that I was never that person with a depression in the first place. Now I do not mean to downplay depression of course, I feel I have to get that straight. But I only gained the realization that it was all just a story of a fictional person I believed myself to be, because I was fully dedicated to find the truth about myself and to free myself from the immense suffering that I was experiencing. Only then, in hindsight, I could reap the benefits and see that it was all an illusion. But I fully understand how hard it is when one is in the midst of a depression and it feels so hopeless and the dreadful feeling that you are totally stuck. All I know now is that the curiosity, courage and willingness to find the truth set me free in the end, and I know that everyone can do it when one wants to be truly free and is ready to give up the story of being a victim of external circumstances. Your true home of peace is waiting for you, you are sitting on a chest of gold and jewels, but don't realize it yet.

2b. I think I covered most of this in the answer to question 1, but I will try to answer this a bit more specifically. In absolute terms there is no outside version of yourself. The awareness that is aware of your most intimate feelings and thoughts, is the same awareness that is aware of all things you experience "outside" yourself. There is only one you, or we could better say, there is only one 'I'. That is the real truth and reality when we look close enough and really investigate into our own being. But of course there is also this individual that is experienced by this 'I'. You could look at it like this: There is only one 'I' which is eternal, limitless consciousness. It is aware of all experience, but is never stained by any experience, meaning no experience can leave a mark on this transparent Being. And because it is timeless, it has no beginning nor end. It just is. Now this consciousness is having a dream of a character, which is the individual you experience with a unique body and mind. This One Source of consciousness creates all kinds of dreams through all kinds of individuals and so creates the diversity of life as the world. So you can see this life, experienced as an individual, as a dream, but you are not really the character in the dream, not this limited body and mind, but the one who is dreaming it. When you falsely believe yourself to be the character in the dream, connection with true Being is lost and so this dreamed character now needs to find this seemingly lost peace and happiness in the world, because it is always looking to complete its story through time, thus never feeling complete. And because it believes to be a finite being, a body that is destined to die, it starts to fear the cessation of time (a.k.a. The Now) and ultimately death, which is another illusion. Yet all you every really experience is this Now. There is no time, it's just a dualistic concept. Even when we think about yesterday or tomorrow, we think about it now. And when yesterday/tomorrow was/will be experienced it was/will be experienced as Now.

I kind of got side-tracked there at the end I think but I was on a roll :D I hope this could give people some insight. If you are more interested in these teachings, there are those who are much better and precise at explaining it than me. Look for non-duality on YouTube and you can be on your way. Peace!
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On the nature of identity, which I am in the midst of struggling to fully comprehend for myself, I felt compelled to share a quick piece I worked on a while ago because I don't think I can describe how it has felt using words. Basically how it feels to look in the mirror most times.

(I had to crop it slightly to avoid possibly breaking any rules, even though technically nothing is censored, so beware, I guess)
Spoiler: show
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Title is probably mistranslated, but I tried my best to get it right. It probably adds to it if it's wrong anyway.
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rodox_head wrote:On the nature of identity, which I am in the midst of struggling to fully comprehend for myself, I felt compelled to share a quick piece I worked on a while ago because I don't think I can describe how it has felt using words. Basically how it feels to look in the mirror most times.

(I had to crop it slightly to avoid possibly breaking any rules, even though technically nothing is censored, so beware, I guess)
Spoiler: show
Image
Title is probably mistranslated, but I tried my best to get it right. It probably adds to it if it's wrong anyway.

great piece!!! i had the same haircut from the figures when i was 15. oh noo
i have those "do i really look like that?" moments too, but nothing of the level represented in the artwork. hope ur okay!! remember, everyone is fuck ugly and we are all just pretending.

Friendly Stranger
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Posts: 13
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everyone is fuck ugly and we are all just pretending

My friend this should be a title to a film or song or merch

Friendly Stranger
Status: Offline
Posts: 13
Joined: 7 Jan 2022
I find depression is like signal flow. You need clear connections. To keep clear connections. Hydrate. Drink lots of water. Drink a pint of water, even two. Meditation. Breathing is a healer. I read the real way to breathe is just through your nose. I've practised this for two weeks and can confirm it keeps me stablisied. Good stuff.

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