01. / 02. Introit / Prophecy At 1420 MHz

[Taint3dBulge]

Been awhile since iv posted, but i finally figured why the flute sounded so familiar. Its very similar to the flute in the opening scene to "the cell." Could they have sampled it? There is even the same kind of shimmer sound at 1:09 of the prophecy video thats also in the cell, when hes flashing the mirror. Almost exactly to my ears. Edit: Just listened to it more and from 2:18-2:25 of "the cell" video and 1:04-1:10 of the "boc" video. They match up almost perfectly, i do think they sampled it from that exact part of the movie. Or are my ears deceiving me.

here are the time stamps.
Cell - https://youtu.be/39x7ZyCVfTg?si=K4oXv7rgXtdw9nym&t=135
BoC - https://youtu.be/74NluS3jzTo?si=3YWR3JsedDWPhVp2&t=63

Sorry about the double post, i couldnt edit the last one. Just thought this was important and reposted the edit.

[atavist]

would love to if it didn't break forum rules and i'm still new here

everything is searchable over there

Good call. I’ll do some digging, thanks

[Den]

The phrasing sounds different to me but there is a strong resemblance. They’ve said that they rarely ever sample records - maybe they tried to recreate it.

Yes, I’m feeling connected to my instincts because after the Mr. Mistake Remix was released I remember thinking “I hope their sound continues to move in this direction.”

I may be projecting, and it’s satisfying for me to think about it this way, but it feels like they’ve been revealing the new direction of their sound in since 2016 through the Nevermen Remix work and Societas X Tape.

The ‘live’ drum sound in Prophecy At 1420 Mhz evokes the Mr. Mistake Remix, and the groove feels connected to Treat Em Right.

There vocal cries and OM sounds in Mr. Mistake sound similar to some of the vocals in PA1420 Mhz. And there’s the Hindustani flute line at the end of Mr. Mistake - the flute that begins the new track also has a Hindustani-like timbre but they’re detuned. I think we may hear more Indian Classical influence throughout Inferno (I’m also thinking of the M. S. Subbulakshmi track on Societas). Industrial raga.

Also, did anyone notice that the percussion in the outro of PA1420 Mhz sounds like gamelan?

I’m still thinking about the resonances between the Nevermen Remixes and the new music. And is anyone else hearing the gamelan-like percussion?

Another note on the percussion: the way the drumset rests for a beat before the shaker-like sound at around 2:17 grooves so hard.

[Scories]

Here is one possible interpretation of the video: at the start, we see white and red dots moving. They could symbolise humanity’s quest for progress and knowledge: one colour representing science and the other spirituality. The central dot seems to me to represent a kind of central authority (power). In their quest, human beings are initially motivated by love and curiosity, hence the heart-shaped/spiral pattern they trace around the central dot. But after coming into contact with the central dot, they begin to form a circle and the shape no longer changes. Curiosity has vanished, love has vanished; everything now revolves around the central power.

Technology (AI/the Internet) and religion (Christianity) are hijacked and placed at the service of power, and now serve as instruments of control (symbolised by the hand), surveillance (symbolised by the eye) and coercion (symbolised by the cross). The authoritative voice that is then heard is not that of a divine loving Creator, but that of an authoritarian power exercising its authority through man-made gods.

Does that make sense ?

"The web has been hijacked by crooks and trolls who have used it to manipulate people all over the world" (Tm Berners-Lee).

The same thing happened with Christianity. Originally, it was an apolitical religion based on love. The early Christians had been cruelly persecuted by the Roman state and put on public display for their refusal to acknowledge the emperor’s divine nature.

In the 4th century AD, the Roman emperor Constantine politicised Christianity by imposing the use of the cross/chi-rho (a symbol borrowed from Egyptian religion) and grafting onto it all manner of beliefs drawn from various religions in order to unify them all under a single syncretic state religion: Catholicism (which means ‘universal’). The belief in hell, gradually introduced into Christianity between the 2nd and 4th centuries AD, later served as a tool of manipulation and terror.

[turquoise70]

Here is one possible interpretation of the video: at the start, we see white and red dots moving. They could symbolise humanity’s quest for progress and knowledge: one colour representing science and the other spirituality. The central dot seems to me to represent a kind of central authority (power). In their quest, human beings are initially motivated by love and curiosity, hence the heart-shaped/spiral pattern they trace around the central dot. But after coming into contact with the central dot, they begin to form a circle and the shape no longer changes. Curiosity has vanished, love has vanished; everything now revolves around the central power.

Technology (AI/the Internet) and religion (Christianity) are hijacked and placed at the service of power, and now serve as instruments of control (symbolised by the hand), surveillance (symbolised by the eye) and coercion (symbolised by the cross). The authoritative voice that is then heard is not that of a divine loving Creator, but that of an authoritarian power exercising its authority through man-made gods.

Does that make sense ?

"The web has been hijacked by crooks and trolls who have used it to manipulate people all over the world" (Tm Berners-Lee).

The same thing happened with Christianity. Originally, it was an apolitical religion based on love. The early Christians had been cruelly persecuted by the Roman state and put on public display for their refusal to acknowledge the emperor’s divine nature.

In the 4th century AD, the Roman emperor Constantine politicised Christianity by imposing the use of the cross/chi-rho (a symbol borrowed from Egyptian religion) and grafting onto it all manner of beliefs drawn from various religions in order to unify them all under a single syncretic state religion: Catholicism (which means ‘universal’). The belief in hell, gradually introduced into Christianity between the 2nd and 4th centuries AD, later served as a tool of manipulation and terror.

I don't know if you're onto something or not, but I really like this.

[WATER_CAN-_-]

and only from the 4th to the 21st century CE being the persecutor

phpBB [media]

[turquoise70]

Imagine, being an early Christian enthralled with a doctrine of love and forgiveness and knowing everything that was to come, all under your banner... hijacked indeed u_u

To their credit, the Lutherans that raised me mostly did reflect those values, and even warned of such hijacking. I saw it coming before I was even old enough to understand just how bad it was.

[Negamuse]

It's not a sample, I don't think the notes line up when you put the two side by side, but it is a similar style of playing, for sure

I mentioned up thread I used to be a big Delerium fan, and they used a lot of the same kind of flutes, sampled from various Arabic sources. That kind of traditional music uses those same little trills and flourishes all over.

They've had a thing for wind instruments a while, they were inspired by the incredible string band and even sampled that run for smallest weird number, and they've done their own playing on alpha and omega and Julie and candy.

Although, I think they used a regular recorder for that, and prophecy sounds like it's using an authentically eastern instrument, like someone suggested a Ney. The tuning is different, the Geogaddi tracks all seem tuned to a Western scale, but this is a bit off, microtonally, Eastern scales do that. Playing is better too, they haven't had to bury it in tape effects like on the Geogaddi tracks

[Wildfire]

Imagine, being an early Christian enthralled with a doctrine of love and forgiveness and knowing everything that was to come, all under your banner... hijacked indeed u_u

To their credit, the Lutherans that raised me mostly did reflect those values, and even warned of such hijacking. I saw it coming before I was even old enough to understand just how bad it was.

Has guilt and redemption not always been baked into all the monotheistic religions though? The problem, at the heart of it all, is that people are very easily manipulated when you give them the offer of everlasting life as a prize for their conformity. A lot of people's underlying motivation in life is based upon fear of death, and the religions understand that simple mechanism so well.

Jesus, was it you indeed
To flirt unkindly with my greed?
Promising eternal life
When you knew it was not right?
When you knew that what I'd need was willingness and comfort there?

[Ottomatik]

I was listening to the Geogaddi vinyl and noticed the Magic Window side already depicted a family and a radio frequency (162.225 MHz), just like Prophecy does.
I don't think there's a particular hidden meaning to decipher there but it's funny how, even on a 25 years old record, they were already using these themes. Though that could add to the theory of Inferno being some sort of follow-up to Geogaddi.
Interestingly the nuclear family now has 4 kids instead of 2 on Magic Window, but just maybe because it looked better?

[Omikron]

The phrasing sounds different to me but there is a strong resemblance. They’ve said that they rarely ever sample records - maybe they tried to recreate it.

I think that's just something they like to say to keep themselves out of legal trouble. Their early releases in particular were full of obscure samples which they probably doubted would ever be identified.

[turquoise70]

Imagine, being an early Christian enthralled with a doctrine of love and forgiveness and knowing everything that was to come, all under your banner... hijacked indeed u_u

To their credit, the Lutherans that raised me mostly did reflect those values, and even warned of such hijacking. I saw it coming before I was even old enough to understand just how bad it was.

Has guilt and redemption not always been baked into all the monotheistic religions though? The problem, at the heart of it all, is that people are very easily manipulated when you give them the offer of everlasting life as a prize for their conformity. A lot of people's underlying motivation in life is based upon fear of death, and the religions understand that simple mechanism so well.

Jesus, was it you indeed
To flirt unkindly with my greed?
Promising eternal life
When you knew it was not right?
When you knew that what I'd need was willingness and comfort there?

Certainly it is true that people are easily manipulated by such things. I am no stranger to the sway of the promise of eternal life on a personal level, having grown up within that frame of mind. Personally I'm a bit agnostic on the issue, though I would consider myself spiritually inclined in general. And if I may quibble on one point, I don't think it's exactly that eternal life is the prize for conformity; the notion is that the soul is eternal regardless of conformity to dogma or not, and the threat or reward of what happens to it is what's at issue.

I do think there's a distinction to be made between "if you accept x savior you won't ever truly die" and "you won't ever truly die no regardless of what happens, and if you accept x savior you're going to the good place, not the bad place" in terms of what might motivate a human to behave a certain way in life

I'm being pedantic I guess but I majored in philosophy, so I don't know what you want from me

[Den]

The phrasing sounds different to me but there is a strong resemblance. They’ve said that they rarely ever sample records - maybe they tried to recreate it.

I think that's just something they like to say to keep themselves out of legal trouble. Their early releases in particular were full of obscure samples which they probably doubted would ever be identified.

They’re mostly on the early recordings, yes. I just think at this point it’s likely rare that they’d ever sample a record in a way that would be easily recognizable. There are instances like the bassline from Hair in Aquarius that they rerecorded for the album version. I’m also thinking of how they recreated the beginning of the Mark Isham song Pittsburg 1901 (Theme from Mrs. Soffel) for Semena Mertvykh without sampling the record itself (I think).

[Wildfire]

I'm being pedantic I guess but I majored in philosophy, so I don't know what you want from me

No you're fine, your pedantry is merited, I meant to say the promise of everlasting life in heaven. Not just everlasting life.

[Davism]

Imagine, being an early Christian enthralled with a doctrine of love and forgiveness and knowing everything that was to come, all under your banner... hijacked indeed u_u

To their credit, the Lutherans that raised me mostly did reflect those values, and even warned of such hijacking. I saw it coming before I was even old enough to understand just how bad it was.

Has guilt and redemption not always been baked into all the monotheistic religions though? The problem, at the heart of it all, is that people are very easily manipulated when you give them the offer of everlasting life as a prize for their conformity. A lot of people's underlying motivation in life is based upon fear of death, and the religions understand that simple mechanism so well.

Jesus, was it you indeed
To flirt unkindly with my greed?
Promising eternal life
When you knew it was not right?
When you knew that what I'd need was willingness and comfort there?

It's funny, I don't feel coerced or manipulated when I make the choice to follow Christ. The quote from Nothing is Real paints God as someone who stacked the cards against us– I think that's a misrepresentation. If God is real, and He created everything (us), how could there be an authentic loving relationship shared between us and Him if He didn't give us free will to also reject Him? The Gospel is that Christ died for our sins so that we may obtain salvation if we have faith, and that doing good works does not get us into Heaven, but only a result of wanting to follow Christ. That's really great news. I don't try to follow Christ because of guilt or because of the threat of eternal separation (Hell), but because I love Him.

Yes, Christ taught love and forgiveness (turn the other cheek, love and pray for your enemies, how radical is that?!?!), but He also warned of Hell and encouraged us to turn away from sin. And if every BoC fan rejected Christ in an effort to reject conformity, aren't you in turn just conforming to the side that rejects Christ? I mean, we all conform, right?

That said, the imagery the broz used in Prophecy of the "televangelist movement" is certainly a fair criticism against Western Christianity (assuming it was a criticism). There have been plenty of people that have been hurt and manipulated by heretical and false churches. Those people do not represent Christ.

[Wildfire]

It's funny, I don't feel coerced or manipulated when I make the choice to follow Christ. The quote from Nothing is Real paints God as someone who stacked the cards against us– I think that's a misrepresentation. If God is real, and He created everything (us), how could there be an authentic loving relationship shared between us and Him if He didn't give us free will to also reject Him? The Gospel is that Christ died for our sins so that we may obtain salvation if we have faith, and that doing good works does not get us into Heaven, but only a result of wanting to follow Christ. That's really great news. I don't try to follow Christ because of guilt or because of the threat of eternal separation (Hell), but because I love Him.

Yes, Christ taught love and forgiveness (turn the other cheek, love and pray for your enemies, how radical is that?!?!), but He also warned of Hell and encouraged us to turn away from sin. And if every BoC fan rejected Christ in an effort to reject conformity, aren't you in turn just conforming to the side that rejects Christ? I mean, we all conform, right?

That said, the imagery the broz used in Prophecy of the "televangelist movement" is certainly a fair criticism against Western Christianity (assuming it was a criticism). There have been plenty of people that have been hurt and manipulated by heretical and false churches. Those people do not represent Christ.

Apologies, I should have chosen my words more carefully, I didn't meant to cause offense. In my experience (I'm agnostic but have married into a devout Christian family), the underlying pull for people to believe is the promise of eternity in heaven and seeing all your loved ones again. And I can completely understand that pull, it's a powerful one.

I've just always struggled with the notion that in order to avoid eternal damnation (the kind I myself will be suffering according to Christians), I need to go against my sense of logic and reason. If the god of this universe punishes people for going with their rationale and intuition, then I guess I have no option but to take my punishment as I am incapable of doing otherwise.

[turquoise70]

IF there is a God that we're all children of, then I am glad to be siblings with the likes of you folks, for the record.

[furewig]

Imagine, being an early Christian enthralled with a doctrine of love and forgiveness and knowing everything that was to come, all under your banner... hijacked indeed u_u

To their credit, the Lutherans that raised me mostly did reflect those values, and even warned of such hijacking. I saw it coming before I was even old enough to understand just how bad it was.

Is it really an issue of hijacking? For most of its history Christianity has been a state religion, in some form or another, and in this way has been a tool for the justification and perpetration of atrocities and for the preservation of unjust rule. What is happening in America with regards to Christianity in this sense is not all that unique, even in modern history. This is obviously not to discount what has been said by you and others here, that obviously Christianity appeals to many real virtues among people, but to emphasize that the narrative of a 'hijacking' seems to sort of ignore the reality that these doctrinal virtues not only contradict but also have historically failed to develop meaningful opposition to the institutional function of the church.

[fujee]

God, it's a grower, isn't it? Love it now after being ambivalent. Tape 05 is more in my listening preferences but Prophecy is an excellent opener. Cannot wait to hear the rest next week.

[Redd Panderson]

Anyone waiting til 5/29 and NOT going to listen/watch? I’m leaning that way…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I am definitely waiting until the 29th.

Those of you who claim you can't avoid it or control yourself or whatever. My advice to you is only allow yourself to listen once or twice, maybe 3 times tops.

Do not over indulge. This music is meant to be listened to all together, and the more you play this single, the less impact it will have and thus without a doubt will poke a hole in your experience of the album.

Everything you do is a balloon.

But is everything we do YOUR balloon?